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Right on dude!

You mean to tell me you need those granp-papa bear visors now!!!

Looks fantastic my friend. Keep up the great work!

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I'd like to be able to prove, just for once, that money wouldn't make me happy...

Wow Serge!

Great pics and an even better template!

Mon petit chou, you will be making sweet music in no time with this sweetie

[QUOTE=Serge Poirier]AAH, the learning curve!

[/QUOTE]
Well, you just shortened mine! Thanks!

Looks like you're doing great Serge! Can't wait to see your F-5 all finished up!

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Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

Thanks folks!

Yup Al, Papa Bear needs 'em visors now, they do make life easier, thanks to Mario for that great tip last year! Thanks my sincere dude!

Carlton, glad i could help you out my good friend, are you making an F5 too buddy?

Dave, i look forward to the next steps, it's a very exciting endeavour so far! Thanks!

Serge, you're really making some headway. I want to follow your build, too, as I hope to build a mando down the road.

Ron

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OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

Thanks Ron and Todd!

WOW guys, i'm happy i'm being contagious with my adventure! Sure is exciting when you aim at building something so small that can deliver such a sweet and big sound at the same time, i apprehend a few steps like carving the plates but i just purchased an instrument maker's plane from Lee Valley's, 36mm i think, very small cute tool anyway!

Here's the cutie:

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=32680&cat=1,41 182

I just can't wait to use that baby and make curls with it, Thanks to my bud Al for this great suggestion!

I'm really looking forward to see you guys build them too!

Your bud Serge!

[QUOTE=Serge Poirier] Carlton, glad i could help you out my good friend, are you making an F5 too buddy?
[/QUOTE]
Nope. But I do predict the need to cut plexiglass in the future. Good to know a jigsaw works okay.

Carlton, do i need to mention that i'd like to see pics!

Nice goin', so far! Roger does many steps in, ummm, strange fashion, the biggest of which is that in his books, he doesn't mention that we should cut the truss rod slot -before- the neck is cut up, or even before the ears are glued on. D-oh!! So.., if you think a step should be done _now_, go ahead; you're probably right <bg>

Don't get overly fussy with templates either; use your eye, and some good judgement; the reason the great ones aren't consistent in archings is because they weren't paying too much attention to arching templates. Just make the outside of the plates nice and even, then carve the interior until the graduations are correct. Avoid lumps and bumps; most important; avoid lumps and bumps! Shoot for smooth transitions and an even graduation. All else will fall in place....

Good luck bending the ribs! When you bend the scroll, leave that piece as long as possible, and bend the scroll first; this way, if it cracks, just cut it at the crack, and start again. If you cut it to lenght before bending, when it cracks, you're screwed!

Let me know when you figure out how to bind these things; I need help <bg>

If you think the neck should be wider at the nut, go ahead and make it so; most modern mandolins are wider than the vintage ones. My personal mando is 1-1/4" at the nut.... Some like the fretboard flat, some like it radiused. Not sure? Make it flat, and radius the next one.... bet you like the flat one.

I use banjo/guitar wire on mine; mandolin wire just didn't last long enough. Turns out that the banjo/guitar wire feels and sounds better to me, anyhow.

GW Musical doesn't advertise so, but he sells very neat wood planes of all sizes and radiuses, that I much prefer over the fancy ones, for much less.... A set of curved scrapers from Lee Valley is a must, also. The one with the French Curve is priceless for this work...

Did I mention binding yet? Arghh! Mario38963.1726157407

I'll follow this build with interest Serge. Though not a Mandolin builder or player myself The workmanship involved in them always impresses me. The wallpaper on my home computer is a back shot of the incredible F5 that Arnt posted here a while back. I find it inspirational.

Colinm

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

Thank you very much Mario! <-----VLG

Great input you just gave me there bud, if i succeed in making this baby sound like one of yours, i'm bringin' it to your place for evaluation, no kidding here!

I hear ya for the truss rod channel, as i was looking at Macrostie's plan, i noticed how slanted the channel was, makes me wonder how You and Arnt are doing this? Certainly not with a router huh? I'm not finished reading the book yet, i'll check on how Siminoff cuts this channel too if he does show it!

will save and print yours and Arnt's posts to help me along with the plan and book, never too much input when it comes to Archtop mandos. I also like the idea of banjo/guitar strings on them and the bending tips! Don't wanna be screwed!

When it comes to the binding part, i'll make sure to bug you a bit about that! In fact, i'll start buggin' you sooner! Thanks Mario!

Thanks Colin, having you being interested in my progress is very motivating, i follow your posts with great attention too and saved many pics of your work already, it is an honor for me to build under my Teachers's scrutiny, hoping that once again, i can really make you all proud!

Thanks

Serge

I'm in the mix here with you on a mando build - though I'm doing an A-
style for my first carved top mandolin...figured it would be easier to learn
the various carving and construction techniques before throwing in
complications like points and scrolls!

I've spent I figure about six hours carving the top and back plates so far.
The outside of the top is getting close - I think I'll have it in another hour
or two plus an hour of sanding. The back is a little rougher...I think
probably another two or three hours carving on it plus an hour of
sanding.

I'm going to use the dowel and drill press trick someone posted recently
to rough out the inside of each plate. I don't know how I'll smooth it out
- I guess sandpaper. I don't have a convex plane, and have no money to
acquire one. This whole instrument is limited to stuff I already have on
hand, not counting some hardware that I got for Christmas.

Here are some pics of where I am right now:

the two plates: (in case you're curious, they're both single-piece quarter
sawn mahogany with mineral streaks)


the top in profile:


the back in profile


Since we seem to have so much mando building going on, do you think
we should petition Lance for a mandolin forum? I mean, come on, there's
a resonator forum!

the idea of banjo/guitar strings

Fret wire. Banjo/guitar -fret wire-. Not strings....<g>

Thanks for your input Jay, what a nice surprise, i did not know you were building one as well!

Yeah, i think i should have started with an A5 too but it's kind of late for me to do that now eh?

Nice mahogany plates there, it should make a very great sounding mando, i will follow your every moves on that, that is way cool bud! Thanks!

And yes, i agree, we should have a mando forum, there are lots more mando builders than i thought there was here!

Thanks for the clarification Mario, maybe i was confused by the " SOUND" part, i stand corrected bud!I have bought mando wire for the first 2 mandos but it's 0.023" tang from LMI ,like on my guitar's fret tang, do you think i should just send it back and have it replaced with what you say? it looks like pretty thick material...

Sergio -- woo hoo you are on your way man!!

Sorry for chiming in so late as I recently returned from a camping vacation.

Good to see you are taking care in making your templates. Acrylic can be a real pain to work with. Hopefully I am not to late -- when you cut your "f" holes in the template take great care to ensure that they are mirror copies of each other. The reason I ask is do you plan on using your template as a guide for routing out your "f" holes.

I am not in total agreement with Mario on the arching templates. I think you'll want to pay close attention to achieving the same height and having the location of the "apex" of your arch at the same location as shown in the templates. If you deviate from the height and apex location it could result in your neck angle being wrong or relying on your bridge to compensate and end up being adjusted to high or low. Other than that -- I totally agree with Mario. You can shape the arching as you see fit. I am drawing on my archtop experience -- but suspect a lot of the same principles apply to mandos as well. Lexan if you can find a source that sells scrap pieces is a lot easier to work with than acrylic.

Arnt -- I really enjoyed reading your post -- that's a lot of great info.

Mario that's a great tip on bending the scroll. Just out of curiousity how thin should the rib be thinned in the scroll area?

Optivisor's are great -- feel no shame my friend many of us use them or have to use them

Here are pics of my progress. I did as Mario suggested and cut the truss rod slot while the neck was in block form. I also cut the 6 degree neck angle. I just need to cut the neck profile, bend the sides, and carve the top and back. As you can see from the high flame, this back is going to be lots of fun This will not be a traditional F5, as it will not have a scroll, but it will just have a cutaway where the scroll goes. I don't have pics of the form yet, but will soon.
Tracy

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Tracy
http://www.luthiersuppliers.com

Thanks a lot my dear friend, you're all forgiven for going on vacation with your lovely family!

Acrylic is what i had on hand right away but for the F-holes, i plan on making a wooden template, as you probably suspect, it didn't go as planned when removing the meat there! . I'm pretty satisfied with the way the acrylic template turned out in the end though, i'll also seek other materials like Arnt mentionned or have other, easy to use material, to work with.

Regarding the arching of the plates, i'm not there yet, i'll wait when i'm there to start a thread on this and see what everyone does so i can find my way of comfort!

Thanks dude, are ya gonna start that SS build soon?

Sergio

Hey WOW Tracy, thanks for sharing these pics bud, is your truss rod channel slanted or straight? It does look straight from what i see on the last picture...

I'm asking because on Macrostie's plan, the truss rod appears to be at an angle with the fretboard! Or is it my sight that's going postal?

Very nice wood you got there, it will look awesome!

[QUOTE=Serge Poirier]
Thanks dude, are ya gonna start that SS build soon?

Sergio[/QUOTE]

Serge -- the SS? Hopefully I will start in October. There are two others I need to finish first.

Making a wooden template for cutting the "f" holes will work. I have an acrylic one that I use. The reason an acrylic or lexan one is the way to go is that its much easier to line up than a wooden one. Mine has a centre line scribed. Have I ever sent you pics of how I route my "f" holes?   

Thanks Anthony, no, i looked in my numerous files but did not find any mentioning how you route the f-holes..just how you bind them actually. the wooden template will be made just for the f-holes exclusively

yes, i did scribe a center line on my acrylic template too! [:)

Serge, you are really cooking!

I am at the airport in Oslo, so I have not had the time to read all the posts, but here are a couple of points.

Arching templates: If you make them without the recurve part, they will be easier to fit to the plate, then just do the recurve by feel when the rest is done. I try to follow the templates as closely as possible, but this is one of the areas where builders have different preferences and one of the most important ways to achieve their tone. Follow Mario's advice and make sure your tranistions are smooth is probably the most important this time. Use a strong directional light and look at the plates from all angles to check this.

If you use the pinned straight mortise neck joint and Siminoff's neck andle jig, your neck angle will be the right height no matter how high yout archings are.

I like a radiused fretboard myself, I think it is close to a 12' radius. I also like bigger frets than most, my last one had medium guitar frets and I really like how that feels.

Keep up the good work!

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin

[QUOTE=Arnt]
If you use the pinned straight mortise neck joint and Siminoff's neck andle jig, your neck angle will be the right height no matter how high yout archings are.
/QUOTE]

My bad Serge -- though seeing what Arnt said I'd sure like to see that neck angle jig.

Serge -- I will email you the picture file on how I route my "f" holes using an acrylic template.

http://luthiersforum.3element.com/forum/useruploads/SergePoi rier/2006-08-30_232148_Michel_&_Maria_0108.JPG

That's Serge's neck angle jig. I use, and recommend you use, the pinned mortise joint; simpler to get right, strong as all get up, and if need be, it can be released the same way as a dovetail. Together with that jig, the proper neck angle is assured.

As for truss rods, there are many types available, so you'll have to decide what to use, then build accordingly. Me? I've stopped using adjustable rods in my mandolins years ago, and have been happier since! Necks are straight, and remain so. I was using leftover steel "T" bar material(old Martin stock, but too short for guitars), but now use either 1/2" or 3/8" square steel tubing. where the enck will be large enough in profile, I'll use the 1/2", but if I need to carve a tiny little neck, the 3/8" gets used, and is proving plenty strong anyhow.

The fretwire is a personal choice; if you have the smaller wire, and think you'll like it, go ahead and use it. I just found it wears down much too easily.

I'd like to see how y'all cut the F holes with routers and templates. I just drill out the two round holes, then cut the rest with a sharp knife. Doesn't take long, and there's no risk of blowouts.

Anthony, the jig is just a board with a cradle part that simulates the bridge. Clamping the neck to the board and resting the body on the cradle automaticly gives you the right angle. You then glue and drill for the dowels when the instrument is in the jig. It is very straight forward, but probably not that easy to visualize by my descripion. Sorry I don't have a picture handy.

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin